What is Sufism?
Published by Haseeb November 27th, 2005 in IslamA common question about Islam people have is regarding Sufism. So what exactly is it? and what makes one a sufi? Is sufism bid’a (a innovation)? Shaykh Faraz recently compiled a list of really good questions and articles on Sufism on his blog. Here are a select few from that list that I have read and highly recommend to all who would like to learn more about real sufism.
The Place of Tasawwuf in Traditional Islam Sh. Nuh Keller How would you respond to the Claim that Sufism is bid’a? Sh. Nuh Keller Tasawwuf and Sharia - Shafiq ur-Rahman The Concept of Bid’a in the Islamic Shariah Sh. Nuh Keller and another one not listed, by one of my Professors from Stony Brook: Mysticism in Islam - William C. Chittick
ima ima sufi, salafis hate on me
so what’s a sufi? and a salafi? in 3 sentences or less for each? don’t have time to check ur links out dude…so swamped here! you should be happy to know however that ur blog is one of my means of procrastination
MR, you gotta be kidding me…….
certain percentage of your friends are salafis then how can they hate on you?
And Nowal you just go worry about SRK, no need to know the difference btw whas a sufi or whas a salafi, go listen to some “One Love…” Bob Marley music, ya man!
Watching Shah Rukh Khan and listening to Bob Marley definitely sounds better than worrying about sufis and salafis (unless salafis blow something else up then someone has to smoke them out).
Oh God, those are not salafees,
how many times I gotta tell you that,
those are Khwaraajees
Real salafees dontblow themselves up. Suicide bombing is a bid’ah, anonymous.
Oh, I could probably tolerate SRK rather than hear you repeat, B.S, i.e false statements.
are y’all hating on SRK now?! is the entire WORLD against him?! bunch of whacks. fine, i’ll go look up the difference between sufism and salafism (?) myself.
Read those links for info on sufism.
As far as ’salafism’ goes, according to my understanding, they are just those who believe that u dont need to a follow a madhab, and they strive to follow the practices of those of the salaf (companions of the prophet (S), and the Muslims of their time).
I personally do follow a madhab (hanafi), but theres no need to debate this issue or anything. Its all a matter of difference of opinion, and in Islam we can agree to disagree on little fiqh matters.
For more information on discussing different madhabs, sufi vs salafi debates, etc. Just listen to this talk: It will answer and END any and every issue u may have about this discussion:
Advice to Seekers by Shaykh Hamza Yusuf (16 MB)
Salamu alaikum
Actually, Salafis have many divisions within them as well. A statement saying that they are those who say “you dont need to follow a madhab” is not accurate. Shaykh Ibn Uthaymeen - Allah
have mercy on him - was a well known Salafi scholar who was staunchly Hanbali (although he may have taken some different positions). Similarly, many Salafi scholars in Saudi follow the Hanbali Madhab as well.
However, I do consider many Salafis as methodologically challenged, as well as people who have strayed from tradition, no matter how hard they try to align themselves with the “Salaf”. Ofcourse, one should not forget how they bypass the well established Usul of the Madhabs within which thousands of scholars throught the centuries worked within, and somehow jump straight the Qur’an and Hadith. It is incoherent and disasterous and that is why many Salafi arguements, although attractive to the ignorant, do not make the learned even bat an eye in doubt.
…. there condemnation of the vast majority of the Muslims (the Ash’aris and Maturidis) whom they label as “close to Ahly Sunnah” doesn thelp either since they put in their statement the likes of Ibn Hajar, Imam Nawawi, Ibn Asakir, Suyuti and many others who are unanimously accepted as Imams of Ahly Sunnah, by both Salafis and others alike, not “close to Ahly Sunnah”. (and yes the Salafis do admit these people had “Ash’ari leanings)
Khayr - Allah
knows best!
Wasalam
I was sort of afraid where they were heading, but I commend all of you doing a great job on stating your opinions in a respectful manner.
It is true there are subdivisions of salafees too, but let me remindyou again, that the khwarajee are not salafee. Also, Ibn Uthaymeen among some other scholars did mostly follow a madhab, as I do as well too, but I think Ibn Uthaymeen, I would not call him a staunch Hanbali, although he did say that it is better for a commoner to follow a madhab as a framework and most salafees do that, we do follow a madhab as a framework. But where there is stronger weighted opinion in certain matters, that is what is followed. I dont know for sure what Ibn Uthaymeen’s way was but I am sure he was not a staunch Hanbali but someone who used mostly the framework of Hanbali.
And indeed salafees mostly follow the Hanbali and Shafiee madhaahib with exception to certain cases such as marriage fiqh rules where the ruling of Abu Hanifah is given more weight. Such as wudhu not breaking for husband or wife due to minor skin contact, whereas in most opinions of the Shafi’ee madhab, it does, etc.
oh give me a break!! Suicide bombing isnt acceptable to salafis? Thats not true and you know it. Suicide bombing is just about the most salafi thing anyone can do, well after telling other muslims that they arent practicing the religion correctly, tearing down the islamic heritage in arabia, and cutting off people’s heads (and hands too!).
Come on, be serious… Hamas is a salafi organization and they have taken credit for literally hundreds of suicide bombings. Qaradhawi justifies suicide bombings in Palestine all the time, so do like 95% of the Imams in Saudi Arabia. Supporting suicide bombings in Palestine is a very long and illustrious tradition among salafis
Oh and Bin Laden is a salafi, and so are all the islamic fundamentalists who are killing people all over the muslim and non-muslim world.
PS: why do salafis always insist an adding extra vowels to the english spelling of any arabic word? (like Islaam, Allaah, Salafee, Aboo, etc)
Salamu Alaikum
Sidi lol! Jazakallahu Khayrun for your reply. It is much appreciated. My statement that Shayth Ibn Uthaymeen was a staunch Hanbali was in the sense that he stuck to the Usul *and* Furu’ of Imam Ahmad - Allah
be pleased with him -. This is unlike some other major Salafi scholars such as Shaykh Bin Baz who considered himself a Mujtahid fi’l Madhab i.e. someone who did not consider himself bound by his Imams furu’ but only followed his Usul in concluding his independent opinions.
When Shaykh Musa Furber - a Damascean, Sufi Hanbali - was asked about Shaykh Ibn Uthaymeen he said that he found instances where Ibn Uthaymeen differed with the mu’atammad (relied upon) Hanbali position but that Ibn Uthaymeen “is clear clarifying what is the mufta bihi and what he prefers.”
Ofcourse some of Shaykh Ibn Uthaymeens positions in ‘Aqida are not looked upon in the same manner as his fiqhi opinions, for - according to many ‘Aqida masters - specific aspects of his beliefs are clearly in contradiction to what many classical scholars stated. I would call some of them anthropomorphic from my personal readings of his works such as his Sharh on ‘Aqida Al Wasitiyya, ‘Aqidat Al Muslim and so forth. However Allah
knows best what he *actually * meant and thus the benefit of the doubt.
Anyone whose had a detailed reading of the Athari ‘Aqida would know that there are quite a few aberrant and “weird” positions the Salafis propound which many of the Hanbalis were clearly free from….
Wasalam
umm like i said earlier, just LISTEN TO THIS:
Advice to Seekers by Shaykh Hamza Yusuf (16 MB)
Salamu alaikum
Just to be fair - there are a number of Sufis who do permit suicide bombing. Mufti Desa’i is one (he is Chishti) and Shaykh Ramadan Al Bouti also permits its (who is Naqshabandi and a Shafi’). The mere fact that Shaykh Ramadhan allows it carries huge weight since he is a leading Faqih in the Arab world.
All of this does not include killing civilians.
Shaykh Ibn Uthaymeen and many other Salafis scholars, on the contrary, condemned suicide bombing. Shaykh Ibn Uthaymeen actually stated the the perpetrator of such an act is doomed to hell (i.e. as punishment, not eternally since all muslims will eventually go to heaven).
As for permissibilty of killing civilian - specific only to Palestine - the only person I know who allowed it is Dr. Qardhawi, and he is certainly not a Salafi per say although he may have some tendencies.
There is an EXCELLENT link by a great Shaykh by the name of Muhammad Afifi who is currently in Oxford regarding Killing Civiliand and its impermissibilty. It is well researched as well as presented and extremely solid fiqh wise. The online version can be read here:
http://www.abc.se/~m9783/maa/dcmm_e.html
“Defending The Transgressed ByCensuring The Reckless Against The Killing Of Civilians”
Wasalam
Salamu Alaikum
Barakallah Feekum Haseeb for the link.
Im going to leave this now Insha’Allah
Ta’aala so please forgive me if Ive said anything wrong.
Request for du’as from everyone
Wasalam
Thanks Br. Salman for the reply to anonymous,
Anonymous, please learn who salafees are, as a salafee, I am telling you those folks are not. They think they are but really, the suicide bombers are khwarajee. Usama may claim to be one, but salafees call him khwarajee. Hamas is Shaf’iee and Qaradhawi is probably Shafi’ee, too.
And reason why we spell with an extra a, is because alif, is pronounced in arabic stretched out, there are other non-salafee people that do this as well. So Allaah has an alif and you would write with two as versus one. The one would only indicate fatha and the two as, the actual alif, so islaam, Allaah, Qur’aan. So it is a difference between a letters and huroof. Hope this helps
Oh so they think they are salafis but they really arent? Come on.. Look the Saudi official government controlled religious scholars, who are salafi, endorse suicide bombing. And salafis generally go through a bunch of apologetics and excuses on behalf of suicide bombers, I see it all the time.
ima ima salafi, sufis hate on me
“hanafi, shafi, salafi, sufi,
i dont care what u are,
as long as u down with convertin the kufar”
-MR
yeah you’re right, salafees are a bunch of loosers, look at me, the biggest looser you have ever seen. What’d I accomplish in life… nothing.
Salafees like me, talk about eemaan and i7saan and what not. We talk about having belief in Allaah’s decree. Yet we are such loosers. We lack patience. We are a nobody, and we go around thinking we are ‘elite’ of the ahlus-sunnah wal jama’aah.
You are right Br. Ahmed Zihni, we are so useless, in fact, we should just blow ourselves up and make sure no one is around. The world would be a better place without people like me.
Wasalaamu 3laykum
(dont worry, I wont blow myself up. Despite being a looser in this world, I have to worry about my hereafter, dont I?)
whoa. did i start a war here haseeb?! anyways, thanks for the link…will check it out as soon as i can. i am spazzing out because of all the notes i have to cram up in the next two weeks. question: can you actually distinguish between a gray and white ramus in the cadaver? good luck with the studying bro.
This is all irrelevant really. The bigger issue is not about sufi or salafi but wether muslims can regain their desire for truth. The real challenge does not come from lack of uniformity, thats really a distraction. Wether muslims can engage the ideologies and more over science of the 21st century in a meaningful way without giving into apologetics is far more important.
I have seen traditional sunni scholars claim salafis as anthromorphic, yet it seems like a huge insult to call any muslim an anthromorphic. Salafis from what i know do say like every other muslim that Allah
does not resemble the creation or does not resemble human beings.
I would like to ask someone if thye can explain to be through email or something.
theres some kind of huge argument about God’s chair being a real chair or a symbolic chair. I dont know, it seems really silly when people are furiously arguing over a chair.
And sister whoever up there,
I didnt say that salafis are losers or loosers, you’re the one who called yourself and other salafis losers, so if you have self esteem issues dont project them on me. Look, I wasnt insulting you personally, I understand that salafis have a diversity of opinion and beliefs, like any other groups. But salafis definitely do support suicide bombing more than others and among the terrorist and militant groups that use the tactic, salafis are very well represented. You cant deny that. If you take that as a personal attack, sorry I cant just say that there arent any salafi terrorist groups or that salafi imams in saudi arabia and all over the arab world dont support suicide bombing. That would be a lie. But I wasnt talking about you specifically. I have no way of knowing whether you support terrorism or not, and you said that you didnt which is good enough for me. I was talking in generalities, about a large group with many subgroups.
(you still think I am a sister, oh well).
No, I was not referring to your post about being a looser and I was not saying all salafees are loosers, just this one. In essence, my post was not to continue an argument with you. It meant: you win.
OMG did u all listen to the talk i put up earlier????
for the LAST time, here it is:
Advice to Seekers by Shaykh Hamza Yusuf (16 MB)
Observations That May Make Me Laugh and even Cry a lil bit, beware…if your a serious type that gets offended at the drop of a pin and doesnt realize that a fellow muslim can respect you without having to be all PC, dont read this post…anyhows without any further interuptions. ( I hope no one including Haseeb takes offense, its just that i’m really bored)
i dont know about you but to me haseeb reads alot of stuff which reminds me of the play “much ado about nothing”…and haseeb is very good at being the muslim verision of PC (he knows how to type in BOLD !!!) except no one listens…
and by the way if you were right about the link ending everything how come you got a clown like me posting this???)
the Zihni is like Cliff Notes for “much ado about nothing,” you dont get the intricacies but he’s straight to the point and holds no punches…though at times i think he’s almost as fanatically obsessed about being against the salafee’s as the salafee’s are about zionists. Secretly i think zihni might be in love with the salafees and they with isreal, its just a thought.
Mujaideen Ryder really loves hip hop and thinks that he can best “rep” sufism against the salafi’s through jingles from american pop culture, no contradictions there. He also thinks songs are the best way to convert the kuffar…songs? allowed? of course, we all listen to them.
Nowal apparently likes to procastinate for any reason whatsoever, i’m betting at least some of that time is devoted to sharukhan movies so if it wasnt for this blog or the bloody wars she was starting on here she’d be doing something else with that precious study time….
Whatever not only knows “whats up” with Amir’s Amrikan pop culture but also is into Desi pop culture, and to top it off thinks the man who said “kill the white people” is the guru of love and all things remiscient of bliss…
Anonymous dont got much to say about nothing which suits this topic very well as this really revolves around “much ado about nothing”…as a matter of fact Haseeb should call it just that.
“muslim” knows all of the salafee’s (by the way a better blog entry would read: how do you spell salafi? is it salafi? salafee? salaaafi?) Not that not knowing how to spell it should stop one from speaking for or against it. Muslim cheer up, seriously self esteem is a good thing.
Apparently only “fake” salafee’s blow up buildings. The “real” ones are all law abiding citizens who promote civility and civic duty by working in soup kitchens, sponsoring poor children in christian and hindu lands and supporing political movements which enfranchise women and get this, actually believe in a government run in accordance to (your not going to believe this) the will of the people! This whole salafee (again someone should get the right spelling…) thing about blowing buildings up and Killing actual people (or is it fake people) its all really merely an exaggeration, those people were going to die anyway. Actually, Osama is really a Bush family member. There’s George, then there’s Jeb and yes Osama, oh wait, no, omg Osama is aa salafee from saudi arabia! And then we get salafee’s who ask is he even real? They really dont know whats real and fake and they want to re-establish islam! They sound more like R.Kelly when he got caught on the tape…then theres that song…i know how you all love music….”She caught me red handed, it wasnt me…..”
At least “muslim” acknowledges that we didnt have men with TNT strapped to themselves in the time of the Prophet pbuh but the mentality behind saying sucide bombing is biddah is like saying toothbrush and toilet paper is bidah, therefore there should be no tootbrushing in islam forever. Now dont even get me started on that thing called Qitaal !
And wats up with this whole thing about Khawarites? You have all these salafee’s calling everyone kuffar and zionist. Hell, you go to a salafee and i’m sure they’ll call Hitler a zioinist, a bad cup of bloody tea is zionist, its like their version of saying “thats wack yo” Well as much as i hate all that junk about crusaders i think this whole Khawarites or whatever you wanna call them is even “wacker” You get all these lame sufi types who when they dont like someone they call them Khawarites (why cant you pick a cooler term to call your enemy anyway like Shredder or Magneto???) Not everyone and everything you dislike is a Khawarites, hell its time to wake up and smell the proverbial 21th century (this is a metaphor for those of you that happen to be literalists unless your just deaf, dumb and blind…) coffee and realize that Khawarites been gone for a long long time. As if sufi’s arent busy enough levitating, they now have to resucitate the dead too! No job too small, no job too large ehh?
My man Salman needs to know that this blog is in english, you sound more like an arabic menu. And what precisely is a classical scholar? Do the taliban who dont speak much arabic, basically speaking pashtu which trust me though full of sounds wierder still even refer to themselves properly as “talibun” classify as classical? If thats the case then is Ricky Martin a classical singer? Makes you wonder what exactly is classy??
Smokey Bear, thas me, well i dont answer the question but then again i was trying to say something wasnt i? (Am i still? May be??)
My favorite part of this entire blog entry is
“Ahmed Says:
December 2nd, 2005 at 3:15 pm
theres some kind of huge argument about God’s chair being a real chair or a symbolic chair. I dont know, it seems really silly when people are furiously arguing over a chair.”
THE POINT OF THIS WHOLE RIDICILOUS EXCERCIZE WAS TO SHOW YOU HOW ODD WE BEHAVE SOMETIMES AND HOW STRANGE THIS DISCUSSION IS….
you mean such as your post, Smokey Bear?
As the name i choose (Smokey Bear) even tends to suggest, i’m not being very serious. Everyone here should know that i mean no one any harm, was merely trying to entertain myself and that Haseeb and Zihni are good friends of mine. I not merely hope but know that they dont mind my humor because in real life i got their backs.
In any event you guys should all check out the Smokey Bear website…i check it out..its pretty kewl
http://www.smokeybear.com/
Of course that love extends to everyone else too even the generic and anonymous people.
Of course that love extends to everyone else too even the generic and anonymous people.
yo smokey bear is the man, listen up when he speaks that cat drops wisdom like its candy you might just learn something
Oh my god, Smokey Bear I just checked out your blog that you linked to and its mad awesome. I never knew smokey the bear was so jacked
hello, i dont know really who creat this site but im so happy that you support outlandish band and qmi yusuf,thy’re are my favourite.
thanks a lot
why does salafi brothers consider three talaqs as one ?